Amazing and fantastical beliefs of Biblical creationists

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Re: The unbelief of Biblical creationists

Postby a_haworthroberts » Mon Aug 05, 2013 10:40 pm

http://www.icr.org/article/7663/
"Evolutionists are hard-pressed to explain how complex, cooperative networks between completely different types of organisms such as these could have come about through Darwinian evolution—particularly when they involve dynamic biochemical networks of interaction in two separate types of organisms."
Might it be something to do with natural selection, Jeffrey? I thought YEC apologists believed in that. Those individuals in different species' populations best adapted to their environment tend to survive longer and pass on their advantageous genes to the next generation.
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Re: Amazing and fantastical beliefs of Biblical creationists

Postby a_haworthroberts » Mon Aug 05, 2013 11:16 pm

Email as sent (minus a PPS and PPPS on a slightly different topic):


My attempted comment here - after Mr Walker censored a perfectly reasonable question about YEC teachings (in this case ones which aren't even found in the Bible), but allowed someone to post some drivel apparently intended as a response to me:
http://biblicalgeology.net/blog/prelimi ... mment-6918

"Lee Abel
Please tell me whether you agree with Tas Walker's answer "the mechanism is the cooling of the oceans" and if so why you agree with it.
Your claim that coal formed into diamonds is nonsense. But hey Tas Walker approves of people posting nonsense here. Putting the word 'FACT' in upper case does not make your comments factual. Your comments also have nothing to do with the original article or with my comments.
I have tried to challenge Tas' answer but after awaiting moderation for around three days my comment was censored by him without explanation. If young Earth creationism is not intellectually bankrupt, why is censorship of contrary views and awkward questioning regularly practised by so many YECs?
Ashley"
PS
The signs so far are NOT good. My comment has failed even to appear on MY screen as 'awaiting moderation'. Have I been 'blacklisted'?
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Re: Amazing and fantastical beliefs of Biblical creationists

Postby a_haworthroberts » Tue Aug 13, 2013 12:26 am

Email as just sent:



http://biblicalgeology.net/blog/prelimi ... um-period/
From the latest Tas Walker response to Saito Singh:
"We tested for carbon-14. As we anticipated we found levels well within the measuring accuracy of the lab equipment, providing good evidence that the million-year ages are not true".

IT IS NOT VERY CLEAR EXACTLY WHAT MR WALKER IS REFERRING TO HERE.

IT CANNOT BE ANY IGNEOUS ROCKS THAT HAVE BEEN (RIGHTLY OR WRONGLY) ASSIGNED AN AGE IN THE MILLIONS OF YEARS. MR LEE ABEL WAS UTTELY CONFUSED WHEN HE ALLEGED THAT CARBON 14 DATING WAS USED TO INCORRECTLY DATE MATERIAL "MERELY A FEW DECADES" OLD AS BEING "AGED AT MILLIONS"; RADIOCARBON DATING CANNOT BE USED FOR MATERIALS MORE THAN 100,000 YEARS OLD AT MOST. MOUNT ST HELENS ERUPTED JUST OVER THREE DECADES AGO AND SURELY THAT IS WHAT ABEL WAS TRYING TO BRING UP - A CREATIONIST MISUSED RADIOMETRIC DATING TO GET A FALSE RESULT OF MILLIONS OF YEARS (NOT CARBON DATING BECAUSE IGNEOUS ROCKS ARE AND NEVER WERE ORGANIC).

HOWEVER, YECS HAVE CLAIMED THAT 'INSTRINSIC' RADIOACTIVE CARBON 14 EXISTS IN OR ON DIAMONDS, COAL AND DINOSAUR FOSSILS (THOUGH THESE, OR THE ROCKS IN OR NEAR WHICH THEY HAVE BEEN FOUND, ARE NOT I REPEAT NOT DATED BY THE RADIOCARBON DATING METHOD).

I ASSUME THAT TAS' COMMENTS ARE NOT REFERRING IN SOME WAY TO THE MELTING OF SEA ICE SINCE THE LAST GLACIAL MAXIMUM (HIS BLOG POST, ON THAT TOPIC, DOES MENTION CARBON 14 DATING 'CALIBRATION'). IN FACT I DO NOT UNDERSTAND THE POST MENTIONS CARBON 14; MIGHT HE BE CONFUSING THE CARBON 14 ISOTOPE WITH PAST CLIMATE AND SEA LEVEL PROXIES INVOLVING THE TWO NON-RADIOACTIVE ISOTOPES OF CARBON AS FOUND EG IN FORAMINIFERA AT THE OCEAN FLOOR?

IF TAS IS ATTEMPTING TO PICK UP FROM THE REMARKS BY LEE ABEL, THAT APPEARS INAPPROPRIATE SINCE (AND MR ABEL HAS DEFINITELY NOT SAID OTHERWISE) WHAT WAS BEING REFERRED TO BY ABEL WAS MOST DEFINITELY NOT ORGANIC MATERIAL THAT MIGHT CONCEIVABLY CONTAIN CARBON 14 - BUT RATHER WAS IGNEOUS ROCKS AND MINERALS ERUPTED FROM MOUNT ST HELENS IN 1980 (ERUPTING VOLCANOES DO SOMETIMES PRODUCE CARBON DIOXIDE BUT NO CARBON 14 ISOTOPES WITHIN IT).

SO IT APPEARS THAT MR WALKER'S COMMENTS ABOUT CARBON 14 MAY BE IGNORING THE CONTEXT OF THE DISCUSSION. HE WRITES: "WE TESTED FOR CARBON 14". THUS, I CAN ONLY ASSUME THAT HE MUST BE REFERRING TO COAL, DIAMONDS OR DINOSAUR SKELETONS AND CLAIMS BY YECS ABOUT DETECTABLE LEVELS OF 'INTRINSIC' CARBON 14 FOUND WITHIN OR ON THESE MATERIALS THAT WERE FORMED FROM/WITHIN ONCE LIVING CREATURES. HE HAS OF COURSE ALREADY ACKNOWLEDGED THAT THOSE WHO DON'T THINK EARTH IS JUST 6,000 YEARS OLD HAVE 'VARIOUS EXPLANATIONS' FOR THESE FINDINGS OF CARBON 14 - AND OF COURSE THEY DO.

THE REST OF THE LATEST REPLY CONFIRMS THE ACCURACY OF WHAT MR SINGH ORIGINALLY WROTE.

Young Earth creationism - which I have recently suggested is intellectually bankrupt - is of course a sincere attempt to match Biblical scriptures with observed and scientifically studied reality and nature.

I find it rather strange that attempts to match the Bible with reality produce such questionable results that even many religious scientists have trouble with. If one assumes there is a God, and that God is a God of truth and also the creator of the universe.

My digging is the sort of thing which happens when YECs allow other people to comment on their blog posts LOL. Most YEC bloggers acknowledge the distinct prospect of intellectual defeat beforehand - either by banning known 'troublemakers' who (politely or impolitely) ask awkward questions, or by banning comments altogether.

I have not submitted a further comment under the Walker blog but would welcome any comment from any quarter. I trust Mr Walker is not trying to defend the words of Mr Abel.
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Re: Amazing and fantastical beliefs of Biblical creationists

Postby a_haworthroberts » Mon Aug 19, 2013 9:54 pm

http://creation.com/natural-selection-evolution
Unsupported assumptions and assertions presented as facts, and general dishonesty (see also the evasive answers to Alex F) by someone who is not even a scientist but a businessman, a former pastor and - clearly - a bit of an ideologue as well.
This is the earlier article: http://creation.com/antifreeze-protein-evolution
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Re: Amazing and fantastical beliefs of Biblical creationists

Postby Brian Jordan » Thu Aug 22, 2013 12:13 pm

Oh dear, will this feigned ignorance never end? Rhetorical question - of course it will never end as long as there are creationists.
"PPSIMMONS is an amorphous mass of stupid" - Rationalwiki
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Re: Amazing and fantastical beliefs of Biblical creationists

Postby Roger Stanyard » Fri Aug 23, 2013 9:05 pm

Brian Jordan wrote:Oh dear, will this feigned ignorance never end? Rhetorical question - of course it will never end as long as there are creationists.


"Marc Ambler grew up in a traditional church in South Africa." That usually means the "Dutch Deformed Church".
Those who believe absurdities will commit atrocities - Voltaire
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Re: Amazing and fantastical beliefs of Biblical creationists

Postby Michael » Sat Aug 24, 2013 6:37 am

Roger Stanyard wrote:
Brian Jordan wrote:Oh dear, will this feigned ignorance never end? Rhetorical question - of course it will never end as long as there are creationists.


"Marc Ambler grew up in a traditional church in South Africa." That usually means the "Dutch Deformed Church".



Actually it could be any evangelical church and Ambler is an English name and thus would not go to an Afrikaans church
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Re: Amazing and fantastical beliefs of Biblical creationists

Postby Peter Henderson » Sat Aug 24, 2013 12:00 pm

Paul Taylor making a big name for himself in tne states:

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/08/20/c ... at-plants/
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Re: Amazing and fantastical beliefs of Biblical creationists

Postby a_haworthroberts » Sun Aug 25, 2013 3:00 pm

Peter Henderson wrote:Paul Taylor making a big name for himself in tne states:

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/08/20/c ... at-plants/



Worth reading (he allows comments too).
http://theness.com/neurologicablog/inde ... #more-5865

Of course, YECs to be consistent must also insist that the very earliest dinosaurs were contemporaneous with the very latest kinds. Not sure whether they have regaled their followers with examples of such (they would of course excuse themselves from having to offer an example of prey-predator encounters unless they thought the individuals in question lived after the Fall).

Edit. Apparently Paul Taylor - whose academic background appears to be chemistry - permits comments too (none have been made): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u-8WL3Uymkg
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